Old 10th March 2007, 06:04 AM   #1
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 5
Default Non Planer Anonymous

Dear Roger,
Hi, I am Jose and I can't plane. I weight 175 lbs and sail a GO165 with the stock fin and the 8.5Retro. Sailing site is open sea. I downhaul and outhaul following your guidelines in previous posts.
I am sure it is a mix of conditions and poor technique, but I am uncertain if wind conditions are soooo poor that makes it impossible for me to at least gather enough speed to improve my technique. Does that make sense to you? Wind at my site is usually gusty, what is your guesstimate of the planing threshold for my setup?
thanks for your help,
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Old 10th March 2007, 10:11 PM   #2
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Zaventem, Belgium
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Default RE: Non Planer Anonymous

what are the average wind conditions (knots or bft) you have at sea and do u let the wind work enough? i mean, do you hang yourself to your sail rather than just stand on the Go, which is very tempting on those big boards. If you think it's your technique thats a bit wrong just look some stuff up on basics on the net. I'm sure there's loads, if you want i'll look up stuff.
Haiko, AKA crazychemical
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Old 11th March 2007, 06:05 PM   #3
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Default RE: Non Planer Anonymous

Hello Jose,
I agree with the first part of crazychemical's response.
We would need to have some idea if there is enough wind to get you planing.
Does your board almost "try to plane" in the gusts, or does it just accelerate a little and then slow back down as the gust subsides?
You could have a technique issue, a rig tuning issue, or a perhaps an issue with mast foot placement.
Or, your "issue" could be simply not enough wind.
No way to tell unless you are pretty sure the wind is at least 12 knots.
As crazychemical suggests, you cannot just stand on your Go 165, holding up your 8.5 Retro and expect the board and rig to magically start planing.
I don't agree with his "hanging down" technique as I've seen this "mis-interpreted" many times into simply dropping your weight straight down on the harness lines with no active pumping or movement back on your board as the board accelerates.
You most certainly need to get your weight off the board, and onto the rig, so that your weight can be turned into mast foot pressure, but it's alot more complex than simply "hanging down".
Let's get some more basic understanding of your problem here:
Are there other sailors on boards and rigs of similar size who are planing in the same area that you are not planing in?
Where do you have the mast foot placed on your board..... back of the slot....middle of the slot....front of the slot?
Are these the specifications for your 2004 GO 165?
Model: Go 165
Volume in liters: 165
Length cm: 262
Width cm: 90
Tail cm:64.2
Fin: Deep Tuttle Drake Race 580 (58 cm)
What year model Sailworks Retro do you have (if you know)?
What mast are you using?
Do you have any digital photos or home video of you sailing at your normal site (where you cannot seem to plane) that you could send to me at my email address?
If I could see what your conditions look like, and particularly see how you have your sail rigged, it would make discovery of your particular issues much easier.
The answer to your question on the "normal planing threshold" for a 175 lb. (79.4 Kg.) sailor with an 8.5 Retro would probably be in the 9-12 knot range, depending on your skills.
Do you have a fairly accurate wind meter?
Is there a nearby airport that you could call the pilot informaton line and get some reasonably accurate wind speeds?
A little more information here and I'm pretty sure we can determine what the principle isses are and give you some ideas to overcome them.
Hope this helps,
Roger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th March 2007, 12:39 PM   #4
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Default RE: Non Planer Anonymous

Dear Guys
Thanks for your help and interest.
I don't have a wind meter, been planning to buy one for a while precisely because of this problem, suggestions on brands are most welcome.
When a gust hits the board only accelerates most of the time, then slows down. Regarding other sailors, we are a small number, most of us beginners. The one sailor I have seen planing uses a sb formula board with a 9.5 neilpryde camber-induced sail, don't remember the sail model. My mast foot is always towards the back, the only thing visible in the back of the slot is the squared hole in which the mast foot is inserted. You have the correct specs for my board. Retro is a 2005, and I use a 490 Joystick mast from the same year. The boom is a 2004 North Pro Comp B+. I rig using a winch and apply downhaul until batten above the boom is 1/4 back from the front of the mast. then outhaul 1.5-2 inches through the top hole in the clew of the sail. I will take pictures of the rigged sail for you to evaluate if I am following your instructions correctly. I will send you these plus pictures of the site and a video of myself sailing, hopefully you can provide feedback on weaknesses I have not spotted in my technique.
Wow, the airport, never thought of that; there is a small airforce base, is not too close but is the closest in the area. Is your email address still sailquik@mindspring.com?
thanks to both of you again.
best regards,
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Old 12th March 2007, 10:35 PM   #5
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Default RE: Non Planer Anonymous

Hi Jose,
Yes, my email address is still [mail]sailquik@mindspring.com[/mail]
Yes, if you could call the Air force base and ask for their pilot weather info number they may be cooperative and tell you what their current windspeed reading is.
Unfortunately, you probably will never plane as early on your GO 165 with your 8.5 Retro as the guy on the 100 cm wide formula board and a 9.5.
Once we have a look at your photos and video perhaps an upgrade to a larger 9.5 or 10.0 m2 Retro will give you alot more planing time, but
first let's have alook at your rigging and technique.
Hope this helps,
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